It was only a matter of time....

[gruden2.0]

Background info from Snuffer if anyone is interested:

There is a new edition of the scriptures being prepared which will use the JST of the Bible. That will result in both the Book of Moses and JS-Matthew being removed from the Pearl of Great Price. When I was asked to take a look at the project I had the impression that a new translation of John's Gospel was needed and ought to replace the missing texts. I asked a qualified Greek Scholar to undertake that project and he declined. But the impression remained that it needed to be done.

I made it the subject of prayer and was told to do the work. I spent a few days working with an English-Greek New Testament, the JS Translation of John, and a Greek Lexicon before becoming hopelessly discouraged by the many options and choices. I prayed about it before retiring for the night and essentially quit. I explained that it would take years for me to accomplish this, and that I was not going to be able to solve the riddles of the text. I went to bed assuming I was done with it.

In the middle of that night I was awakened and given the solution to every dilemma I had been facing in the work on the text. So the next day I continued on from where I had abandoned the work and, to my surprise, everything was opened to my mind so clearly and continuously that the entire project was completed in less than three weeks. The light of heaven opened the material in a way I had never thought of nor had previously attained to in considering the Gospel of John. At times it progressed so rapidly that I was unable to finish one part before the next came rolling out. Many new and different things were added, and at least one thing was dropped entirely because it was not part of John's original composition.

Because of the rapid way it rolled out, once I finished the text I went back to clean up a lot of what had been left as incomplete sentences, run-on sentences, missing words (particularly conjunctions) and cryptic or inadequate explanations. The intent of the writer, John, was revealed, including why some things were included in the text and the manner he wrote.

When it began it was an attempt at a "translation" but by the time it was completed it was clearly a "revelation" and not merely a translation of a text. Therefore the result does not have my name on it, because I cannot claim any credit for the content. I failed in what I was attempting. What resulted came from heaven.

-Denver Snuffer

[Silver Pie]

Did you read it? Hard to discern anything without looking at it, otherwise you're confusing discernment with bias.

I love the Snufferite/Denver-Snuffer-fan comebacks. Entertaining.

Sorry, but looked at dispassionately, this seems like a rather stupid reply. (Note: I did not call you stupid; I called the reply stupid. I think you are an intelligent man.]

Question: "Did you read it?"

Answer: "Let me assume I know who you worship/honor and slam you."

How hard is it to say yes or no?

How logical is it, really, to judge a book one has never read?

If I had posted the opening post and someone asked me this and I had not read the book, I would have said, "No. I don't feel a need to read it because I don't trust the author." Or, maybe I would have thought it might be good to read the book so that I could make better arguments against its contents.

[Silver Pie]

This is exactly was Christ was talking about in these days. This is a great example. It will get worse; even to a a point where the righteous saints will have to flee their towns escape to the Rockies.

I do agree with you that the days are coming that those who will not take up their sword against their neighbor will have to flee. It will be "kill or be killed" or flee. (Not sure if that's exactly what you meant, but your comment seemed spot on. Anarchy will reign. People will be killing each other and tormenting each other for, I suspect, any number of reasons: color, politics, race, religion. Only the humble followers of Christ will survive, according to the scriptures, if I'm understanding them correctly.)

[EdGoble]

Did you read it? Hard to discern anything without looking at it, otherwise you're confusing discernment with bias.

I love the Snufferite/Denver-Snuffer-fan comebacks. Entertaining.

Sorry, but looked at dispassionately, this seems like a rather stupid reply. (Note: I did not call you stupid; I called the reply stupid. I think you are an intelligent man.]

Question: "Did you read it?"

Answer: "Let me assume I know who you worship/honor and slam you."

How hard is it to say yes or no?

How logical is it, really, to judge a book one has never read?

If I had posted the opening post and someone asked me this and I had not read the book, I would have said, "No. I don't feel a need to read it because I don't trust the author." Or, maybe I would have thought it might be good to read the book so that I could make better arguments against its contents.

Here's the passion that I have about taking any time to answer your post: Yawn.

[AI2.0]

Did you read it? Hard to discern anything without looking at it, otherwise you're confusing discernment with bias.

I love the Snufferite/Denver-Snuffer-fan comebacks. Entertaining.

Sorry, but looked at dispassionately, this seems like a rather stupid reply. (Note: I did not call you stupid; I called the reply stupid. I think you are an intelligent man.]

Question: "Did you read it?"

Answer: "Let me assume I know who you worship/honor and slam you."

How hard is it to say yes or no?

How logical is it, really, to judge a book one has never read?

If I had posted the opening post and someone asked me this and I had not read the book, I would have said, "No. I don't feel a need to read it because I don't trust the author." Or, maybe I would have thought it might be good to read the book so that I could make better arguments against its contents.

Do you believe anyone has the ability and the right to write scripture? If so, then I'd understand you chiding Ed for not reading the 'scriptures' that Denver Snuffer is putting forward, but as an LDS believer, I don't believe just anyone can write scripture--I think some can try, but it isn't true scripture unless they are divinely called of God to do this. The learned and those who think they are wise (Denver Snuffer fits this description IMO) may attempt to do so, such as in the case of William McLellin;

“At the conference the elders decided that ten thousand copies of the sixty-five revelations should be printed under the title, ‘Book of Commandments.’ Oliver Cowdery read the Lord’s preface, and several brethren arose and bore witness to its truth and the truth of all the revelations received by the Prophet. The Prophet expressed his deep gratitude for the Lord’s commandments. He entertained no doubts concerning the divine inspiration of the revelation he received for the guidance of the Church. …

“Not all those present at the conference fully approved the revelations. One at least, questioned the language of them: William E. McLellin. The challenge was answered in a revelation: [D&C 67:5–8].

“McLellin, who, in the words of the Prophet, had ‘more learning than sense, endeavored to write a commandment like unto one of the least of the Lord’s.’ [History of the Church, 1:226.] McLellin had taught school rather successfully in five states of the Union and had acquired considerable learning. His attempt to write a revelation was a miserable failure. Joseph Smith said: ‘… It was an awful responsibility to write in the name of the Lord. The Elders and all present that witnessed this vain attempt of a man to imitate the language of Jesus Christ, renewed their faith in the fulness of the Gospel, and in the truth of the commandments and revelations which the Lord had given to the Church through my instrumentality. …’ [History of the Church, 1:226]

https://www.lds.org/manual/doctrine-and ... s?lang=eng

Denver Snuffer can attempt to write scripture, but LDS members know he is not a prophet of God, so we are not obligated to read what he writes and we can recognize and comment on the folly of his attempts-- just as others did when McLellin tried to do the same.

[mhewett]

My responses in blue:

I have recently walked away from the church but it has nothing to do with Denver. In fact, i have only read one and a half of his talks and there is nothing that is out of line with the doctrine of Christ.I can understand why you would believe this, much of what Denver Snuffer has written is not out of line--in fact, I understand that some of his earlier books are in line with church teachings. However, from my own experience reading his lectures and blog posts, I think you haven't read enough or you are possibly not that well versed in gospel teachings because you will certainly find that his writings do include things that are not in line with the doctrine of Christ.

So, you may be wondering why I have seperated from a church I was true and loyal to? I hope that all of you, who are eager to persecute verbally those of us who have walked away, will be willing to listen to me so you don't make the mistake in thinking that DS is the cause for everyone's departure

The church forced me to choose between them and JS. There were things that did not set right with me here and there but I brought my views into line with the brethren because I believed they were true prophets. I don't believe the church forced you to do anything. I think you lost faith in the living prophets, and whether you like it or admit it, faith in the doctrine of continuing revelation and living prophets IS a foundational principle of the LDS church. You cannot choose to not believe in this and remain comfortable within the church.

However, when the leaders changed doctrine of children being baptized because of the sin of their parents, I knew their was something seriously wrong. They called it revelation after they were uncovered. However, I still kept going and praying for understanding. It never came, the only thing that come to my mind was the scripture to not forbid the children to come unto Christ.Since the majority of the members understand the purpose for this policy and feel at peace with it, then I think most of us see the reason for this and trust our church leaders to do what is right and necessary for the times--but apparently you do not. Were you upset that children of polygamous parents have been in the same boat for decades? Why was that not a concern for you? Or were you able to see the wisdom in that policy?

Then... the letter urging all members to vote against any legislation that would allow the legalization of cannabis for recreational use was read in church! This should offend every member of this group. It does not matter whether or not YOU agree with the use or not, you do not have the right to dictate someone else's life. Of course the church will take a stand, it is their obligation and duty to support societal laws which help us from degrading into chaos and unchecked wickedness. Are you seriously angry at the church for not wanting to see drugs take further hold on our society??? Can you NOT SEE where we are headed? Do you not see that drug addiction is a serious problem and is destroying families, the potential of people--allowing them to live their lives in a drug infused stupor? And, actually, society does have the right to dictate what will and won't be legal. That's what laws are about. You might want to spend some time studying history and various societies so you can understand why laws are passed and why you don't really want to live in a society where there are no restrictions on what people can and can't do.

It was then that I was lead to a book called Joseph Fought Polygamy that put the nail in the coffin for me. I despise this doctrine and have always felt it was wrong, because I knew JS was a true PSR and the BOM was true, I swallowed my feelings about it and continued on in my life as a faithful member of the church I guess you were glad to find a book that supported your long held beliefs. FYI, if the book is telling you that, it's wrong. Joseph Smith did practice polygamy- he didn't fight it. But if it makes you feel good to believe lies, that's your prerogative, no one can force truth on you.

I have walked away from the church, fellowship with many DS followers and have found the greatest joy. If you were unsure and wanted to listen to my explanations and were willing to give them the benefit of the doubt, then I'd be happy to discuss with you--and I'm sure other members would be too, but if your mind is made up and you have such a terrible opinion of us, our leaders and our church, then there's no point in discussion. You clearly cannot respect us if you have such a low opinion of us.

You want to condemn and point fingers at those who follow Denver as being mislead, you better look in the mirror. They are no more mislead than you are.. Yes, I do believe in the line of authority 'nonsense'. I have a testimony of this gospel and the Lord's 'only true and living church on the earth'. I know Thomas S. Monson is a prophet of God, he has the keys to lead us and he leads us through divine revelation. I know that Jesus Christ is my Savior and he leads and guides THIS CHURCH. I know that Joseph Smith Jr., Brigham Young and all the others down to Pres. Monson were prophets, seers and revelators. I know that we have 12 apostles who also receive revelation and they hold the priesthood authority to do so. The Book of Mormon is divine scripture and if we read it and pray, with a humble heart, we can know the truths that are contained in it.

So, there you have it! I follow the doctrine that JS revealed. That makes me a true Latter Day Saint and one who is not being mislead. My suggestion to all of you is cast the beam out of your own eye first.

I'm sorry, but you have stopped your own progression by refusing to accept the very basic tenet of what used to be your faith--and that is continuing revelation from a Prophet of God--one who has the priesthood authority to lead and guide you--unless you reject it--which apparently you have. This may sound harsh, but Joseph Smith Jr. would be the first to tell you that you've rejected the gospel he restored and gave his life for. The church he restored was to be led by a living prophet, through priesthood authority, 12 apostles, temple ordinances etc. 'line upon line, precept upon precept', over time preparing a humble, teachable Zion people. There was no place in his church for someone 'wresting keys' because they refused to humble themselves to that authority and admit they were out of harmony. There is no place for the proud, the rebellious, those who refuse to be taught, this church is too uncomfortable for them--they take themselves out, just as you have done.

I don't know how much you'll enjoy this forum now that you've taken a stand against the LDS church. Just be warned that if you continue to say such derogatory things about the LDS faith, there are enough of us devout members here that we will challenge you in defense of our beliefs.

Amen, well said

[Silver Pie]

Do you believe anyone has the ability and the right to write scripture? If so, then I'd understand you chiding Ed for not reading the 'scriptures' that Denver Snuffer is putting forward, but as an LDS believer, I don't believe just anyone can write scripture--I think some can try, but it isn't true scripture unless they are divinely called of God to do this.

I did not chide him for not reading it. I don't care if he read it or not. I chided him for sidestepping the question when the answer would have been so easy to give.

[Silver Pie]

Here's the passion that I have about taking any time to answer your post: Yawn.

The answer was easy to give. I don't care if you've read it, but it makes for a totally boring thread (-| when one replies the way you did. I was hoping for something interesting, for some back and forth. I like mentally stimulating discussions. You let me down with your nonanswer.

[BringerOfJoy]

Yes, Ed, it really WAS only a matter of time. True prophets prophecy. True prophets create scripture, and the Canon grows. As President Monson quoted in a talk long ago, ”the dogs bark, but the caravan rolls on. Even a Caravan that has been stalled in the desert for a long, long time.

[Silver Pie]

Yes, Ed, it really WAS only a matter of time. True prophets prophecy. True prophets create scripture, and the Canon grows.

Very true.

[Joel]

Seeing this thread again reminded me that today is James Jesse Strang's birthday, he was a self-described prophet, seer and revelator and would discover and translate a set of metal plates which he generously showed to anyone who asked to see them. He even declared himself King of the Kingdom of God on Earth

At one point, Strang had nearly 12,000 followers and his church, known as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Strangites), would rival that of his predecessor, Joseph Smith.

Read more about this guy:

http://www.strangstudies.org/James_Jesse_Strang/

http://www.strangite.org/Welcome.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voree_plates

[AI2.0]

Do you believe anyone has the ability and the right to write scripture? If so, then I'd understand you chiding Ed for not reading the 'scriptures' that Denver Snuffer is putting forward, but as an LDS believer, I don't believe just anyone can write scripture--I think some can try, but it isn't true scripture unless they are divinely called of God to do this.

I did not chide him for not reading it. I don't care if he read it or not. I chided him for sidestepping the question when the answer would have been so easy to give.

You actually asked him three questions in your post, it was your second question which elicited my comment.

[brianj]

Seeing this thread again reminded me that today is James Jesse Strang's birthday, he was a self-described prophet, seer and revelator and would discover and translate a set of metal plates which he generously showed to anyone who asked to see them. He even declared himself King of the Kingdom of God on Earth

At one point, Strang had nearly 12,000 followers and his church, known as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Strangites), would rival that of his predecessor, Joseph Smith.

Read more about this guy:

http://www.strangstudies.org/James_Jesse_Strang/

http://www.strangite.org/Welcome.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voree_plates

That whole situation after Joseph Smith's death blows my mind. How could the early Saints have thought, "We should divide into a bunch of -ites. It worked so well for the Nephites and Lamanites!" Splintering into Brighamites, Rigdonites, Strangites, Culverites, and probably other groups didn't do anything to benefit the Kingdom of God.

It also bothers me when people at church claim the RLDS started because Emma Smith said that her son was supposed to be the new leader of the church. Emma aligned with Sidney Rigdon so this claim is false.

[Rose Garden]

Seeing this thread again reminded me that today is James Jesse Strang's birthday, he was a self-described prophet, seer and revelator and would discover and translate a set of metal plates which he generously showed to anyone who asked to see them. He even declared himself King of the Kingdom of God on Earth

At one point, Strang had nearly 12,000 followers and his church, known as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Strangites), would rival that of his predecessor, Joseph Smith.

Read more about this guy:

http://www.strangstudies.org/James_Jesse_Strang/

http://www.strangite.org/Welcome.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voree_plates

That whole situation after Joseph Smith's death blows my mind. How could the early Saints have thought, "We should divide into a bunch of -ites. It worked so well for the Nephites and Lamanites!" Splintering into Brighamites, Rigdonites, Strangites, Culverites, and probably other groups didn't do anything to benefit the Kingdom of God.

It also bothers me when people at church claim the RLDS started because Emma Smith said that her son was supposed to be the new leader of the church. Emma aligned with Sidney Rigdon so this claim is false.

People don't realize they are aligning into -ites when they are doing so. Otherwise, I don't believe they would do it.

[brianj]

People don't realize they are aligning into -ites when they are doing so. Otherwise, I don't believe they would do it.

They may not realize it at the time, but they will realize it at some point. At that point why dig their heels in even more firmly instead of realizing something's not right?

[Rose Garden]

People don't realize they are aligning into -ites when they are doing so. Otherwise, I don't believe they would do it.

They may not realize it at the time, but they will realize it at some point. At that point why dig their heels in even more firmly instead of realizing something's not right?

That is true. It certainly can be difficult for humans to come to an understanding of their foolishness.

[AI2.0]

This thread was about Denver Snuffer's scriptural account of John, but he's now put out new scriptures for his followers, his versions of the Old and New Testaments, the Doctrine and Covenants (which include his revelations) and what he calls 'Pearls of Great Price'.

This link was posted by inho to a thread in the Outer Darkness sub forum:

The Remnant movement is now publishing their own edition of scriptures.
This edition puts Lectures on Faith back into Doctrine and Covenants, and removes some of the sections. Most importantly, their Pearls of Great Price canonize some revelations Snuffer has received. There are other changes too.

There is a blog post about that in Wheat & Tares:
Denver Snuffer’s Teachings to be Canonized as Scripture

https://wheatandtares.org/2017/03/22/de ... canonized/

From the link:

The Restoration Edition is still a work in progress, and believers are encouraged to review the materials and submit suggestions via a designated email address. The goal is to eventually have a final product presented for approval at a future conference.

The new scriptures are based on the current mainstream Mormon canon with heavy modification. All verse numbering is eliminated (excepting Proverbs), and chapter divisions have been reworked (excepting the Book of Mormon where chapter divisions were determined by Joseph Smith). Punctuation is minimal “in order to free up the text for greater possible interpretation.”

Their Old Testament and New Testament is based on the Joseph Smith Translation. In the Old Testament the Song of Solomon is eliminated (Joseph declared it uninspired), and the book of Proverbs now includes sayings from both Joseph Smith and Denver Snuffer. The Book of Mormon is based on the 1840 edition, benefiting from Joseph Smith’s corrections to the 1830 and 1837 editions.

The Restoration Edition of the Doctrine and Covenants is radically altered. Some changes:

All sections not authored by Joseph Smith are eliminated. Sections authored by Joseph Smith were compared to manuscripts from the Joseph Smith Papers Project. Sections which have questionable documentation (like the Kirtland Temple visitation by Elijah and others in D&C 110) or based on fragments of Joseph’s teachings (D&C 129) were removed. (Believers also find the hand-shake instructions in D&C 129 ineffective in discerning lying spirits.)
Lectures on Faith are back in!
Official Declarations removed: “Official Declarations 1 & 2 are declarations made by a different church.”
D&C 132 is still in, but it’s Denver Snuffer’s edited version. (Snuffer doesn’t believe Joseph Smith practiced polygamy.)
In the Appendix is a section titled “A Prophet’s Prerogative” by Jeff Savage. Using the example of Nephi and Joseph Smith’s creative approach to Isaiah 29, Savage argues that “a prophet can apply a generalized prophecy for a large body of God’s people over multiple dispensations to a more specific meaning only intended for [a smaller group,] even when that means adding and rearranging details not found in the original prophecy.” However, because Isaiah’s original prophecy is still useful in it’s broader meaning, the original KJV version is retained in addition to Nephi and Joseph Smith’s narrower Book of Mormon-centric interpretations.
Like the Doctrine and Covenants, the new Pearls of Great Price (note the switch from singular to plural) has many changes. Here’s a sampling:

The section “Governing Principles” lays down principles and practices of the new movement. I’ll go deeper into this below.
The full Wentworth Letter replaces the previous Articles of Faith to provide better context.
A new section called “Testimony of John” contains “a newly revealed account of John the Beloved’s Testimony of Jesus the Messiah” (Denver Snuffer’s inspired and expanded translation of John’s gospel in the New Testament).
Denver Snuffer’s revelations are tacked on to the end. There are 9 so far, though it is expected additional revelations will be added in the future.

So it seems that Denver Snuffer is moving forward with his belief that the keys were 'wrested' from Pres. Monson and the quorum of 12 apostles and given to him. He's made major alterations to the scriptures, even including his own revelations and the only way he could do this is if he has the authority to do it. Of course he doesn't have the authority to do this, but there's no doubt now that he believes he has authority.

Will his followers in the Remnant movement finally admit that Denver Snuffer believes himself to be their 'Prophet, Seer and Revelator'?

[Silver Pie]

You actually asked him three questions in your post, it was your second question which elicited my comment.

Oh, I see. Thank you for pointing that out. My mind was focused on him not answering because I had hoped to read some back and forth interaction between the two of them, so I didn't notice my inconsistencies. I appreciate you pointing that out.

[Silver Pie]

This thread was about Denver Snuffer's scriptural account of John, but he's now put out new scriptures for his followers, his versions of the Old and New Testaments, the Doctrine and Covenants (which include his revelations) and what he calls 'Pearls of Great Price'.

Actually, Denver did not put them out. Other people came up with the idea, and had done a lot of work before he became aware of them. There were two groups that contacted Denver, but he thought that it was just one group. When Denver realized that there were two groups, he made arrangements for them to meet each other, according to the friend I have who is part of the group that put them together. He did not write them nor was he the one who did the research to find out what it was that Joseph had actually written and what someone else had added or taken away. He did, however, give permission for the people to put in anything of his that they wanted to. He did not name the Pearls of Great Price. None of this was his idea.

[Silver Pie]

So it seems that Denver Snuffer is moving forward with his belief that the keys were 'wrested' from Pres. Monson and the quorum of 12 apostles and given to him. He's made major alterations to the scriptures, even including his own revelations and the only way he could do this is if he has the authority to do it. Of course he doesn't have the authority to do this, but there's no doubt now that he believes he has authority.

Will his followers in the Remnant movement finally admit that Denver Snuffer believes himself to be their 'Prophet, Seer and Revelator'?

He's definitely moving forward.

It's true that the only way he could do this is if he has the authority to do so. What's scary is what if he really does have the authority? What if God really is behind this? What if God is in the process of creating another city of peace (like Enoch's city, like Melchizedek's city) so that there will be safety when everyone is killing and tormenting each other, in the future? What if this (this period of time spanning a decade or more) call to repentance from Denver is the last one the Gentiles will have before God turns His full attention to the remnant of Lehi?

Or, maybe you are right. Maybe BrianM is right that Denver has secret plans. I dunno, but I've chosen my side and you've chosen yours. Still, I hope we can love and respect each other in spite of it. I know that when I'm reading a thread that's going back and forth between factions, I'll often read your posts because you seem to be a voice of reason. You seem to think before you write.

[AI2.0]

This thread was about Denver Snuffer's scriptural account of John, but he's now put out new scriptures for his followers, his versions of the Old and New Testaments, the Doctrine and Covenants (which include his revelations) and what he calls 'Pearls of Great Price'.

Actually, Denver did not put them out. Other people came up with the idea, and had done a lot of work before he became aware of them. There were two groups that contacted Denver, but he thought that it was just one group. When Denver realized that there were two groups, he made arrangements for them to meet each other, according to the friend I have who is part of the group that put them together. He did not write them nor was he the one who did the research to find out what it was that Joseph had actually written and what someone else had added or taken away. He did, however, give permission for the people to put in anything of his that they wanted to. He did not name the Pearls of Great Price. None of this was his idea.

Thanks for clarifying.

So others are responsible for these new scriptures? I assume they are all people within his Remnant movement, since it sounds like it has been tailored to his teachings, adding things and removing things that fit his views.

[AI2.0]

So it seems that Denver Snuffer is moving forward with his belief that the keys were 'wrested' from Pres. Monson and the quorum of 12 apostles and given to him. He's made major alterations to the scriptures, even including his own revelations and the only way he could do this is if he has the authority to do it. Of course he doesn't have the authority to do this, but there's no doubt now that he believes he has authority.

Will his followers in the Remnant movement finally admit that Denver Snuffer believes himself to be their 'Prophet, Seer and Revelator'?

He's definitely moving forward.

It's true that the only way he could do this is if he has the authority to do so. What's scary is what if he really does have the authority? What if God really is behind this? What if God is in the process of creating another city of peace (like Enoch's city, like Melchizedek's city) so that there will be safety when everyone is killing and tormenting each other, in the future? What if this (this period of time spanning a decade or more) call to repentance from Denver is the last one the Gentiles will have before God turns His full attention to the remnant of Lehi?

Or, maybe you are right. Maybe BrianM is right that Denver has secret plans. I dunno, but I've chosen my side and you've chosen yours. Still, I hope we can love and respect each other in spite of it. I know that when I'm reading a thread that's going back and forth between factions, I'll often read your posts because you seem to be a voice of reason. You seem to think before you write.

Thanks Silver pie and thanks for filling me in on the goings on. While I'm one who thinks he has no authority to do what he's doing, I know there are still several on the forum who do believe him and have rejected the LDS church because of his influence. I'm curious where this movement is headed and personally, I see these new scriptures as a turning point, but I appreciate you letting me know that this was spearheaded by others and not Denver Snuffer. I did not know that.

I'm curious if you know if Remnant followers now recognize Denver Snuffer as their prophet?

[Silver Pie]

So others are responsible for these new scriptures? I assume they are all people within his Remnant movement, since it sounds like it has been tailored to his teachings, adding things and removing things that fit his views.

Yes, they were all people in the movement. They wanted to get back to what Joseph had written. For example, the Book of Mormon is the 1840 version with very, very little correction of spelling and punctuation. The Doctrine and Covenants has the Lectures on Faith edited out, and other changes have been made, but I'm just starting to read that, so I don't know all that has been changed even though it was spelled out in the St. George conference we just had (I like the fact that it has been made available to read before anyone decides to vote yea or nay on accepting them).

As far as I know, the only thing that has been tailored to fit his views are the things specifically authored by him (the book of John that he wrote, for example, is in the Pearls of Great Price; Joseph Smith's translation of John is still in the New Testament).

[Silver Pie]

Thanks Silver pie and thanks for filling me in on the goings on. While I'm one who thinks he has no authority to do what he's doing, I know there are still several on the forum who do believe him and have rejected the LDS church because of his influence. I'm curious where this movement is headed and personally, I see these new scriptures as a turning point, but I appreciate you letting me know that this was spearheaded by others and not Denver Snuffer. I did not know that.

I'm curious if you know if Remnant followers now recognize Denver Snuffer as their prophet?

I am curious as to where this movement is going to end up. And I agree with you; these scriptures are definitely a turning point.

Some call him a prophet, but most don't like to use that word. "True messenger from God" is more often used. And even within the movement, there is much discussion and argument and disagreement about things he has taught. Some move on. I expect this scripture project, even though he did not spearhead it, will cause more to leave-mostly because of the vote to consider them scriptures that is coming up this fall.

[Rose Garden]

So others are responsible for these new scriptures? I assume they are all people within his Remnant movement, since it sounds like it has been tailored to his teachings, adding things and removing things that fit his views.

Yes, they were all people in the movement. They wanted to get back to what Joseph had written. For example, the Book of Mormon is the 1840 version with very, very little correction of spelling and punctuation. The Doctrine and Covenants has the Lectures on Faith edited out, and other changes have been made, but I'm just starting to read that, so I don't know all that has been changed even though it was spelled out in the St. George conference we just had (I like the fact that it has been made available to read before anyone decides to vote yea or nay on accepting them).

As far as I know, the only thing that has been tailored to fit his views are the things specifically authored by him (the book of John that he wrote, for example, is in the Pearls of Great Price; Joseph Smith's translation of John is still in the New Testament).

I'm confused. Are you saying that the Doctrine and Covenants that is part of this collection does not contain the Lectures on Faith? (I guess I could go check, but I figure it might be best to clarify on the forum as well.)