Boys will be boys, except when they're girls

[shadow]

FWIW -

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/c ... nouncement" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Church Responds to BSA Policy Announcement

In response to media inquiries about a recent Boy Scouts of America policy change, the following statement has been released:

"The Church is studying the announcement made yesterday by Boy Scouts of America. Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs. In recent years the Church has made several changes to its programs for youth and continues to look for ways to better serve its families and young people worldwide."

The issue is that the BSA did this because they said they legally had to. If they legally had to then the troops will legally have to as well. It's only a matter of time and I'm sure the church already has a backup program to replace it.

[h_p]

FWIW -

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/c ... nouncement" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Church Responds to BSA Policy Announcement

In response to media inquiries about a recent Boy Scouts of America policy change, the following statement has been released:

"The Church is studying the announcement made yesterday by Boy Scouts of America. Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs. In recent years the Church has made several changes to its programs for youth and continues to look for ways to better serve its families and young people worldwide."

So the BSA blindsided them again. Big surprise. Someone tell me again with a straight face how this organization is an integral part of the gospel?

[gkearney]

It's only a matter of time and I'm sure the church already has a backup program to replace it.

I hear this claim of a backup program all the time but no one can tell me why, if that was indeed the case they have never seen fit to implement it in parts of the world where the church once use scouting, Australia for example.

[tribrac]

I politely decline the invitation to donate to friends of scouting. No reason to make a scene or offend a brother. I do donate generously to the annual scout fundraiser?


In other news, I bet the new merit badges are gonna be awesome.

[EmmaLee]

As a leader in a unit sponsored by the LDS church you will not have to ... accept girls into the unit.

That is not true, according to the Deseret News article I posted on page 1 of this thread -

"Chief Scout Executive Michael Surbaugh said nothing about church-sponsored Scouting units being given a similar flexibility regarding the registration and participation of transgender youth."

No one knows at this point if that will change, so no one can say that units sponsored by the LDS Church will not have to accept girls into it. The exemption you're talking about, as of this moment, ONLY applies to the various units determining who their LEADERS can be, NOT whether they can decide for themselves to allow girls who are pretending to be boys in.

[shadow]

It's only a matter of time and I'm sure the church already has a backup program to replace it.

I hear this claim of a backup program all the time but no one can tell me why, if that was indeed the case they have never seen fit to implement it in parts of the world where the church once use scouting, Australia for example.

The church agrees with the scout motto: Be Prepared.

[skmo]

During his ministry Jesus showed extraordinary friendliness and hospitality towards disreputable people. He spend time with outcasts that were shunned by those who called themselves righteous. I believe that if Jesus child lived today, he would hang out with transgendered kids.

He also refused to acknowledge the false teachings of groups who had perverted the gospel truth. People who tried to trick Him into a trap found He knew enough to not fall into their plan. The current path of the BSA is a trap, plain and simple. I would hope the LDS leaders are giving the BSA time to bring their organization away from the perverted way they're heading before they sever ties. Everyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, and the BSA is certainly doing everything they can to remove doubt that they're a group with no dignity left.

When He did go to the sinners, He taught them how to come into the light, I don't believe He ever told anyone they were welcome to sin all they wanted and still follow Him.

[skmo]

FWIW -

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/c ... nouncement" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Church Responds to BSA Policy Announcement

In response to media inquiries about a recent Boy Scouts of America policy change, the following statement has been released:

"The Church is studying the announcement made yesterday by Boy Scouts of America. Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs. In recent years the Church has made several changes to its programs for youth and continues to look for ways to better serve its families and young people worldwide."

So the BSA blindsided them again. Big surprise. Someone tell me again with a straight face how this organization is an integral part of the gospel?

I see the BSA's promises to actually be:

"We recognize that some of our biggest sponsors have deeply held beliefs we need to change in their little boys, so we're going to tell those sponsors whatever we need to to make them believe we'll allow them to have their backwards ways. We're confident that as long as we keep them on the line of our organization we can keep feeding them our perverted lies until they believe in the same corrupt god we do."

[JK4Woods]

Friends for Scouting supports the council as I understand.

Would not paying into FFS be a voice for this change?

Currently the Boy Scouts is the activity arm of the Aaronic Priesthood program. It is an integral part of our religion. How do you revolt against the activity arm of the Aaronic Priesthood program without rebelling against Church leaders and their desires? Friends for Scouting is being advertised and we are encouraged to contribute by the Bishop during sacrament meeting opening exercises and during opening exercises of Priesthood meetings. Yes, it is in principle a freewill donation, but it clearly is important to the leaders of the Church.

-Finrock

In our stake (very well off) Friends of Scouting is really driven home because the financial impact to the local council ensures clout in the decisions and influence.

Even at the height of the depression in '09 & '10, our stake re-doubled the fund raising to increase the leverage of the LDS faction.

Now that the gay thing has happened, we get one wave of the envelope from the pulpit at the start of the fund raising drive, and not another mention during the duration of the Friends of Scouting drive. Donations have collapsed in our neck of the woods...

[Sunain]

So how's that going to work when a girl who wants to pretend she's a boy goes on a camp-out with our ward's scout troop?

"BEST. CAMPOUT. EVER!"

Can they even call it "Boy" scouts anymore after this decision?!
Maybe this is a way go get more guys into camping and scouting out if girls can come too!

Wow! So let me get this straight, if a boy wants his non member girlfriend ( who is investigating the church, wink, wink) to go camping with him on his next ward campout, then all he has to do is check "male" on her form and bingo she can sleep with him out in the wild? Is this correct? Or will the church continue to require a person to comply with the sex stated on their birth certificate contrary to new BSA rules?

Yeah, I can see a few incidents occurring unless they segregate them in different tents but wouldn't that actually create an exclusionary feel, something that this decision is actually supposed to avoid by allowing transgendered into scouting to make it look like they are open to inclusion?

The church really needs to distance themselves now from the Scouting program and just create their own Young Men's program like they have outside of the USA. Here in Canada scouting is/was only part of the church program from 12-14 year olds, most of which couldn't wait to get out of the program or just joined the normal youth church weekly activity. They should have transitioned when the scouts allowed gays in.

How many more changes contrary to our beliefs must be forced upon us in the scouting program before the church finally decides to pull out?

The Church is studying the announcement made yesterday by Boy Scouts of America.
http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/c ... nouncement" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The time for 'study' is way passed. We've known for awhile that this would be the next change just like a year or two ago with the gay change. The church should have already had 'studied' this and had a decision ready before this announcement.

When the time for decision arrives, the time for preparation is past.
President Monson
https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... e?lang=eng" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I feel as though the church has not been prepared for the gay and now the transgendered announcement, not very encouraging for the youth when the church youth programs are on shaky ground.

[David13]

Friends for Scouting supports the council as I understand.

Would not paying into FFS be a voice for this change?

Currently the Boy Scouts is the activity arm of the Aaronic Priesthood program. It is an integral part of our religion. How do you revolt against the activity arm of the Aaronic Priesthood program without rebelling against Church leaders and their desires? Friends for Scouting is being advertised and we are encouraged to contribute by the Bishop during sacrament meeting opening exercises and during opening exercises of Priesthood meetings. Yes, it is in principle a freewill donation, but it clearly is important to the leaders of the Church.

-Finrock

In our stake (very well off) Friends of Scouting is really driven home because the financial impact to the local council ensures clout in the decisions and influence.

Even at the height of the depression in '09 & '10, our stake re-doubled the fund raising to increase the leverage of the LDS faction.

Now that the gay thing has happened, we get one wave of the envelope from the pulpit at the start of the fund raising drive, and not another mention during the duration of the Friends of Scouting drive. Donations have collapsed in our neck of the woods...[/qu

Well, rightfully so. You want them to teach morality. They want to teach perversion.
dc

[pjbrownie]

Whenever the Scouting controversy rears it's head, it's funny to watch those that march to the Follow the Prophet no matter what mantra talk about going rogue. Lol.

[brianj]

As a leader in a unit sponsored by the LDS church you will not have to ... accept girls into the unit.

That is not true, according to the Deseret News article I posted on page 1 of this thread -

"Chief Scout Executive Michael Surbaugh said nothing about church-sponsored Scouting units being given a similar flexibility regarding the registration and participation of transgender youth."

No one knows at this point if that will change, so no one can say that units sponsored by the LDS Church will not have to accept girls into it. The exemption you're talking about, as of this moment, ONLY applies to the various units determining who their LEADERS can be, NOT whether they can decide for themselves to allow girls who are pretending to be boys in.

You obviously missed the statement from the church, which includes this sentence: "Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs."

[inho]

It's only a matter of time and I'm sure the church already has a backup program to replace it.

I hear this claim of a backup program all the time but no one can tell me why, if that was indeed the case they have never seen fit to implement it in parts of the world where the church once use scouting, Australia for example.

The church already has the Duty to God. What more is needed?

[EmmaLee]

As a leader in a unit sponsored by the LDS church you will not have to ... accept girls into the unit.

That is not true, according to the Deseret News article I posted on page 1 of this thread -

"Chief Scout Executive Michael Surbaugh said nothing about church-sponsored Scouting units being given a similar flexibility regarding the registration and participation of transgender youth."

No one knows at this point if that will change, so no one can say that units sponsored by the LDS Church will not have to accept girls into it. The exemption you're talking about, as of this moment, ONLY applies to the various units determining who their LEADERS can be, NOT whether they can decide for themselves to allow girls who are pretending to be boys in.

You obviously missed the statement from the church, which includes this sentence: "Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs."

No, I didn't miss it - I'm the one who posted it in this thread, lol. I also posted the statement by the BSA CEO, which contradicts the Church's 'newsroom' statement. It would be nice if they'd all get their stories straight. Hopefully, the BSA will allow the various religious troops to organize how they want - can't see that continuing on for long though.

[Todd]

...As a leader in a unit sponsored by the LDS church you will not have to accept a flaming homosexual who wants to be an assistant scoutmaster and share your tent, nor will you have to accept girls into the unit...

What about jamborees and other "mixed" scouting campouts? Would you concede that LDS youth will be camping next to girls, who checked the boy box on their enrollment form, at these national events? Do you think it is plausible that LDS youth will be taught and instructed at these national events by, as you put it, "flaming homosexuals"?

I'm really not convinced the church can insulate its youth from the wave of social changes rippling through the scouting program. Do you really believe the LGBQT community will be satisfied with letting the Church continue to discriminate against gay and transgender people in the scouting program?

[h_p]

You obviously missed the statement from the church, which includes this sentence: "Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs."

I'm sure the Seacaucus troop in New Jersey that got crucified over this feels that assurance most warmly.

[inho]

While reading posts in this thread, I feel unsure if there is more uproar because people don't accept transgenderism or if people are concerned about boys and girls camping together.
When I was young, I had a hobby that took me to several campouts where boys and girls were mixed. I think we mostly slept in separate tents, but I'm not completely sure. I didn't realize it at that time that some would concider it to be an abomination.

[Todd]

While reading posts in this thread, I feel unsure if there is more uproar because people don't accept transgenderism or if people are concerned about boys and girls camping together.
When I was young, I had a hobby that took me to several campouts where boys and girls were mixed. I think we mostly slept in separate tents, but I'm not completely sure. I didn't realize it at that time that some would concider it to be an abomination.

The church already has a coed camp out program. It's call TREK. So no, boys and girls camping in different tents is not the problem or as you put it, an "abomination" as far as the church is concerned.

I think the problem is when boys and girls are sleeping together. In the same tent. Is it possible you might see an issue there? If not we don't have much common ground to discuss this.

[h_p]

This tweet seems appropriate for what's going on here:

[gkearney]

It's only a matter of time and I'm sure the church already has a backup program to replace it.

I hear this claim of a backup program all the time but no one can tell me why, if that was indeed the case they have never seen fit to implement it in parts of the world where the church once use scouting, Australia for example.

The church already has the Duty to God. What more is needed?

Duty to God is not an activity program and was never designed to be one. Rather it is a recognition program with, I would argue, a rather ill defined set of objectives and requirements. Indeed the young women's program is far better than Duty to God. Once, some time ago the Duty to God program had a clear set of goals and objectives, that is simply not the case any longer as I discovered when I attempted with my son to try and figure out just what was intended to be done in it.

At any rate Duty to God has no clear activity program with in it and activity is what the scouting program in the church is really all about. I watch a once thriving LDS scouting program in Australia be reduced to nothing and not really replaced with anything. IN my stake their the activity rate of young men dropped off to almost nothing at all. It was a shocking turn of events.

[brianj]

...As a leader in a unit sponsored by the LDS church you will not have to accept a flaming homosexual who wants to be an assistant scoutmaster and share your tent, nor will you have to accept girls into the unit...

What about jamborees and other "mixed" scouting campouts? Would you concede that LDS youth will be camping next to girls, who checked the boy box on their enrollment form, at these national events? Do you think it is plausible that LDS youth will be taught and instructed at these national events by, as you put it, "flaming homosexuals"?

I'm really not convinced the church can insulate its youth from the wave of social changes rippling through the scouting program. Do you really believe the LGBQT community will be satisfied with letting the Church continue to discriminate against gay and transgender people in the scouting program?

No, I will not concede that LDS youth will be camping next to girls at Jamborees or summer camps. Yes, there will probably be girls at those events, but they will not be sleeping in the same location as the LDS troops. They will be nearby but not in the very next tent.

And there's a big difference between letting a homoxesual individual teach a particular subject and having them be the day in, day out leader and role model for a troop. If a homosexual wants to teach archery, basketry, or chess, why should I have a problem with it? But if that person wants to be a role model for a troop every week, they are going to have a lot of opportunity to shape the boys into worldly individuals instead of upstanding Saints.

And no, leftists in general won't be satisfied until everything is their way. They they will see the consequences of what they want and they'll blame the people who kept things going for those consequences. During the campaign Hillary Clinton sad that churches will have to change their beliefs. When the LDS church lets everybody into the temples to do whatever they want inside, when the church teaches that nothing is a sin, and when the church directs sealers to perform ordinances for homosexuals, the liberals will be temporarily satisfied. But then they'll quickly resume the fight for female ordination and demand half the general authorities be replaced with women.

[brianj]

You obviously missed the statement from the church, which includes this sentence: "Boy Scouts has assured its religious chartering organizations that, as in the past, they will be able to organize their troops in a way fully consistent with their religious beliefs."

No, I didn't miss it - I'm the one who posted it in this thread, lol. I also posted the statement by the BSA CEO, which contradicts the Church's 'newsroom' statement. It would be nice if they'd all get their stories straight. Hopefully, the BSA will allow the various religious troops to organize how they want - can't see that continuing on for long though.[/quote]

The BSA CEO statement was made before the church statement. Though nobody here is privy to what really happened, and if someone was in the know they would be bound by a nondisclosure agreement, we can infer that Monday morning either a message was sent to churches that sponsor troops or a phone call was made between a church leader (or probably members of a committee) to the BSA CEO and in that call the BSA assured the church that they would be able to maintain their standards.

[Col. Flagg]

They just need to remove 'morally straight' from the Scout Oath and they're good. #-o

[h_p]

And change the name to BGTQSA :ymparty: