Davidic servant?

For discussion of liberty, freedom, government and politics.

Who is the future Davidic servant?

A mortal man yet to come forward
32
55%
Jesus Christ
13
22%
Joseph Smith
4
7%
Adam
0
No votes
John the Beloved
1
2%
Some other immortal not mentioned
5
9%
Nobody, there is no such person
3
5%
 
Total votes: 58
Nebguy
captain of 50
Posts: 88

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Nebguy »

Because I live in Nebraska?

jwharton
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3067
Location: USA

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by jwharton »

Nebguy wrote:Because I live in Nebraska?
No, because I have no idea what specifically you are saying "no" in regard to.
Would you please offer more specific critiques?

Matchmaker
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2266

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Matchmaker »

I think the Davidic Servant of the last days is the Lord. I believe He has already been on earth a number of times and will continue to do so when he needs to be as he continues to help prepare the world for His Triumphal return.

EhyehAsherEhyeh
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Posts: 9

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by EhyehAsherEhyeh »

BMC wrote:Joseph Smith - History 1:40
40 In addition to these, he quoted the eleventh chapter of Isaiah, saying that it was about to be fulfilled. He quoted also the third chapter of Acts, twenty-second and twenty-third verses, precisely as they stand in our New Testament. He said that that prophet was Christ; but the day had not yet come when “they who would not hear his voice should be cut off from among the people,” but soon would come.
Christ appearance as a prophet as spoken of in Isaiah 11 and Acts 3:22-23, has not come yet. Isaiah 11 also corresponds with the mighty and strong one who shall set in order the House of God. I believe from this account from Joseph Smith that was dictated to him by an Angel, is Christ as the mighty and strong one not coming as Himself, but His appearance to us who is as a prophet who shall be rejected by His people a second time and nonetheless those shall be cut off. A future event, as recorded here that has not happened, but was soon. I guess it's due anytime.
Even if Christ came in a new name and was among the children of men, a Son of man overcoming the world breaking the snare. He would not reveal himself to the world that all scripture may be fulfilled.

What you have spoken has been fulfilled already.

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BMC
captain of 100
Posts: 458
Location: The tent of my Fathers
Contact:

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by BMC »

So scripture can only be fulfilled once.. that's not how His kingdom works, the Angel Moroni declared to Joseph that it hadn't been fulfilled yet- but ok.

EhyehAsherEhyeh
Hi, I'm new.
Posts: 9

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by EhyehAsherEhyeh »

BMC wrote:So scripture can only be fulfilled once.. that's not how His kingdom works, the Angel Moroni declared to Joseph that it hadn't been fulfilled yet- but ok.
It is now fulfilled what you said about Christ being rejected a second time, as it was in past so was it in present that eternal law may be justified. 'He went unto his own and his own received him not' This justify's by eternal law the church going through the threshing process because Christ was rejected as a Son of man which is necessary for the sorting of the wheat from the chaff. Hence in revelation 13 as follows.

6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

10 He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

Christ will suffer His church to be broken up that the truly righteous among it may stand his Second coming. So it will be suffered to be so that the Antichrist will have power over the church to overcome it members and to put them under his laws. Blessed are the saints whom endure in patience and faith unto the end and lift not the sword or betray others to save themselves. In the time of darkness it is expected for saints to be lights upon the earth not be as the fearful take up arms and kill anyone they perceive is a threat to themselves or family, sadly it was known from beginning many would be overcome and break the commandment of Moses. Those saints who do such will not be welcome in Zion and shall be prevented from entering it by God the Son, for at that time the Son of man has overcome mortality and restored the transgression of Adam and is the first to part take of the fruit that all righteousness be fulfilled.

DRC53
captain of 100
Posts: 103

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by DRC53 »

cayenne wrote:This is an interesting topic

So is this David servant real? or not?

What are the facts of his life if he is real?

I personally think he is real, I think Avraham Gileadi nailed it…..and from Avraham's books and scripture ……I learned all this….

He is hated, hidden, despised for a time, yet speaks the truth sharply and it angers people. He has the birthright, He has an amazing wife unlike most woman, He nearly dies of an illness, He has/had a Jethro figure in his life like Moses, he is from the East/North…yet for a time he sins badly, and feels no one listens to him teach the truth (I bet if he came to Avraham, he would be rejected until the time) and he suffers terribly for his brethren like a type of Christ. There is some more that I can't remember…..

By the way, I guess David Cohen claims to be David, yet we learn from scripture David is part Ephraim and part Judah….oops…i think Cohen is Levi and Ephraim…..little stuff like this is so easy to spot, and disqualifies Cohen.

So anyone claiming to be him better fit all his qualifications….and me thinks he is very disliked, which means whether he is in Israel, or America, or Siberia, or Mormon, Catholic, etc…..he is hated (know anyone like this?) or maybe he is yet to be born? etc
I'm curious where you got that the Davidic servant would "sin badly." Let me know because I am intrigued by that observation. Thank you!

Matchmaker
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2266

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Matchmaker »

"He is hated, hidden, despised for a time, yet speaks the truth sharply and it angers people."

This sounds almost like a description of our forum member Adonai, AKA EhyehAsherEhyeh.

Isaiah
captain of 100
Posts: 311

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Isaiah »

Yes prophets can and do and will come from outside the church.
There is to be great judgements and a cleansing of the saints before
we will be (allowed) to "assist" the remnants of Jacob, and House of Israel
who's land this has been given to; to build the New Jerusalem
and be numbered with them.
A Man like Moses, the Marred servant, One mighty and Strong,
the Branch, and I'm sure others.
A GREAT prophet is coming very soon.
I believe he will come not from within our church
and will have more power and authority than our church leaders.
He will have Christ's words. He will bring forth a record,
(the sealed portion of the (B of M) yet many (church and church members)
will not believe him or receive his words., and they will be cut off from the Lord.

3 Nephi 21: 8 And when that day shall come, it shall come to pass that kings shall shut their mouths; for that which had not been told them shall they see; and that which they had not heard shall they consider.

9 For in that day, for my sake shall the Father work a work, which shall be a great and a marvelous work among them; and there shall be among them those who will not believe it, although a man shall declare it unto them.

10 But behold, the life of my servant shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him, although he shall be marred because of them. Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil.

11 Therefore it shall come to pass that whosoever will not believe in my words, who am Jesus Christ, which the Father shall cause him to bring forth unto the Gentiles, and shall give unto him power that he shall bring them forth unto the Gentiles, (it shall be done even as Moses said) they shall be cut off from among my people who are of the covenant.

This is not Joseph Smith, because this "servant", "shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him", Joseph Smith was killed.

This marred servant, marred because most members
will not believe his words is John.
The "marred servant" is John the Revelator

He will be a descendent of Jesse, or of the
royal Davidic lineage.
he will be a righteous ruler because he will
judge the people, hence he is a Davidic king.

It is this mission, ( he saw himself in Revelations)
what his own mission would be; to gather Israel
in the last days, and be an Elias - a forerunner
to the coming of Christ. Just as John the Baptist
was an Elias - a forerunner to Christ.
For this important mission he (John the Rev.)
has tarried in the flesh for 19 centuries.

He is the "Root of Jessie" in Isaiah 11,
also the Davidic King and may also be the
Man like Moses, and whom rightly belongs,
who holds the keys of the
priesthood and the kingdom.
D&C113:4-6 6 "Behold, thus saith the Lord,
it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph,
unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
D&C113
1 Who is the Stem of Jesse spoken of in the
1st, 2d, 3d, 4th, and 5th verses of the
11th chapter of Isaiah?

2 Verily thus saith the Lord: It is Christ.

3 What is the rod spoken of in the first verse of the
11th chapter of Isaiah, that should come of the Stem of Jesse?

4 Behold, thus saith the Lord: It is a servant in the hands of Christ,
who is partly a descendant of Jesse as well as of Ephraim,
or of the house of Joseph, on whom there is laid much power.

5 What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

6 Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse,
as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 Nephi 21:10
10 "But behold, the life of my servant
shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him,
although he shall be marred because of them.
Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them
that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil."

Isaiah 52:15 "sprinkle many nations"
Joseph Smith translated this to be -
"Gather many nation" see JS trans.
Isaiah 52:
14 "As many were astonished at thee;
his visage was so marred more than any man,
and his form more than the sons of men:
15 So shall he SPRINKLE (JST gather) many nations;
the kings shall shut their mouths at him:
for that which had not been told them shall they see;
and that which they had not heard shall they consider."
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Ether 4:
13 Come unto me, O ye Gentiles, and I will show unto you the greater things, the knowledge which is hid up because of unbelief.

14 Come unto me, O ye house of Israel, and it shall be made manifest unto you how great things the Father hath laid up for you, from the foundation of the world; and it hath not come unto you, because of unbelief.

15 Behold, when ye shall rend that veil of unbelief which doth cause you to remain in your awful state of wickedness, and hardness of heart, and blindness of mind, then shall the great and marvelous things which have been hid up from the foundation of the world from you—yea, when ye shall call upon the Father in my name, with a broken heart and a contrite spirit, then shall ye know that the Father hath remembered the covenant which he made unto your fathers, O house of Israel.

16 And then shall my revelations which I have caused to be written by my servant John be unfolded in the eyes of all the people. Remember, when ye see these things, ye shall know that the time is at hand that they shall be made manifest in very deed.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://lds.net/forums/topic/48904-avrah ... c-servant/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The Gentiles, will harm and mar this Servant. On account of this, even as the Davidic Servant will be "marred", he will be completely healed by the LORD. This healing might involve him being "translated" and also his receiving of his "Calling and Election made sure". This healing will be truly miraculous for all to see.

The Davidic King will prepare the way for Christ's return. The Davidic King will have a three-year ministry that reaches to the world and warns the entire world of what is to come. Similarly, the 144,000 and also the ANGELS will gather the righteous from throughout the world. But the tribulations of that day will probably have begun before the Davidic King's official ministry to the World has started. We Gentiles, and also the entire World, will have two choices when the Davidic King arrives: we will either (1) harden our hearts to our own condemnation and destruction; or else (2) we will repent and prepare to join Zion. There will be a complete division between the righteous and the wicked in that day.

The Great and Marvelous Work will probably not begin until the Davidic King's three-year official ministry starts. We have not seen the "Great and Marvelous Work", yet; [I assume it means there will be another marvelous work greater than the one during Joseph Smiths time?]. This event is still future and it will be incredible. Among other things, the Davidic King will completely restore House of Israel.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gileadi
page 4
The Gathering of Israel’s Outcasts from Exile

A hard fact of Isaiah’s end-time scenario is that it is not those who appear to be God’s people whom God saves in the end but those who are rejected by the majority. These “outcasts” suffer “reproach” and “ridicule,” are “excluded” from God’s people, and, like God’s servant who gathers them, are “despised” and “abhorred” until God reverses their circumstances (Isaiah 49:7–8; 51:7; 60:15–16; 61:7, 9; 66:5–8). In the end, those who are excluded and betrayed by their own people, are gathered with God’s righteous remnant: “Thus says my Lord Jehovah, who gathers up the outcasts of Israel: ‘I will gather others to those already gathered’” (Isaiah 56:3, 8).

Matchmaker
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2266

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Matchmaker »

Isaiah wrote:Yes prophets can and do and will come from outside the church.
There is to be great judgements and a cleansing of the saints before
we will be (allowed) to "assist" the remnants of Jacob, and House of Israel
who's land this has been given to; to build the New Jerusalem
and be numbered with them.
A Man like Moses, the Marred servant, One mighty and Strong,
the Branch, and I'm sure others.
A GREAT prophet is coming very soon.
I believe he will come not from within our church
and will have more power and authority than our church leaders.
He will have Christ's words. He will bring forth a record,
(the sealed portion of the (B of M) yet many (church and church members)
will not believe him or receive his words., and they will be cut off from the Lord.

3 Nephi 21: 8 And when that day shall come, it shall come to pass that kings shall shut their mouths; for that which had not been told them shall they see; and that which they had not heard shall they consider.

9 For in that day, for my sake shall the Father work a work, which shall be a great and a marvelous work among them; and there shall be among them those who will not believe it, although a man shall declare it unto them.

10 But behold, the life of my servant shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him, although he shall be marred because of them. Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil.

11 Therefore it shall come to pass that whosoever will not believe in my words, who am Jesus Christ, which the Father shall cause him to bring forth unto the Gentiles, and shall give unto him power that he shall bring them forth unto the Gentiles, (it shall be done even as Moses said) they shall be cut off from among my people who are of the covenant.

This is not Joseph Smith, because this "servant", "shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him", Joseph Smith was killed.

This marred servant, marred because most members
will not believe his words is John.
The "marred servant" is John the Revelator

He will be a descendent of Jesse, or of the
royal Davidic lineage.
he will be a righteous ruler because he will
judge the people, hence he is a Davidic king.

It is this mission, ( he saw himself in Revelations)
what his own mission would be; to gather Israel
in the last days, and be an Elias - a forerunner
to the coming of Christ. Just as John the Baptist
was an Elias - a forerunner to Christ.
For this important mission he (John the Rev.)
has tarried in the flesh for 19 centuries.

He is the "Root of Jessie" in Isaiah 11,
also the Davidic King and may also be the
Man like Moses, and whom rightly belongs,
who holds the keys of the
priesthood and the kingdom.
D&C113:4-6 6 "Behold, thus saith the Lord,
it is a descendant of Jesse, as well as of Joseph,
unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
D&C113
1 Who is the Stem of Jesse spoken of in the
1st, 2d, 3d, 4th, and 5th verses of the
11th chapter of Isaiah?

2 Verily thus saith the Lord: It is Christ.

3 What is the rod spoken of in the first verse of the
11th chapter of Isaiah, that should come of the Stem of Jesse?

4 Behold, thus saith the Lord: It is a servant in the hands of Christ,
who is partly a descendant of Jesse as well as of Ephraim,
or of the house of Joseph, on whom there is laid much power.

5 What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

6 Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse,
as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 Nephi 21:10
10 "But behold, the life of my servant
shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him,
although he shall be marred because of them.
Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them
that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil."

Isaiah 52:15 "sprinkle many nations"
Joseph Smith translated this to be -
"Gather many nation" see JS trans.
Isaiah 52:
14 "As many were astonished at thee;
his visage was so marred more than any man,
and his form more than the sons of men:
15 So shall he SPRINKLE (JST gather) many nations;
the kings shall shut their mouths at him:
for that which had not been told them shall they see;
and that which they had not heard shall they consider."
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Ether 4:
13 Come unto me, O ye Gentiles, and I will show unto you the greater things, the knowledge which is hid up because of unbelief.

14 Come unto me, O ye house of Israel, and it shall be made manifest unto you how great things the Father hath laid up for you, from the foundation of the world; and it hath not come unto you, because of unbelief.

15 Behold, when ye shall rend that veil of unbelief which doth cause you to remain in your awful state of wickedness, and hardness of heart, and blindness of mind, then shall the great and marvelous things which have been hid up from the foundation of the world from you—yea, when ye shall call upon the Father in my name, with a broken heart and a contrite spirit, then shall ye know that the Father hath remembered the covenant which he made unto your fathers, O house of Israel.

16 And then shall my revelations which I have caused to be written by my servant John be unfolded in the eyes of all the people. Remember, when ye see these things, ye shall know that the time is at hand that they shall be made manifest in very deed.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://lds.net/forums/topic/48904-avrah ... c-servant/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The Gentiles, will harm and mar this Servant. On account of this, even as the Davidic Servant will be "marred", he will be completely healed by the LORD. This healing might involve him being "translated" and also his receiving of his "Calling and Election made sure". This healing will be truly miraculous for all to see.

The Davidic King will prepare the way for Christ's return. The Davidic King will have a three-year ministry that reaches to the world and warns the entire world of what is to come. Similarly, the 144,000 and also the ANGELS will gather the righteous from throughout the world. But the tribulations of that day will probably have begun before the Davidic King's official ministry to the World has started. We Gentiles, and also the entire World, will have two choices when the Davidic King arrives: we will either (1) harden our hearts to our own condemnation and destruction; or else (2) we will repent and prepare to join Zion. There will be a complete division between the righteous and the wicked in that day.

The Great and Marvelous Work will probably not begin until the Davidic King's three-year official ministry starts. We have not seen the "Great and Marvelous Work", yet; [I assume it means there will be another marvelous work greater than the one during Joseph Smiths time?]. This event is still future and it will be incredible. Among other things, the Davidic King will completely restore House of Israel.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gileadi
page 4
The Gathering of Israel’s Outcasts from Exile

A hard fact of Isaiah’s end-time scenario is that it is not those who appear to be God’s people whom God saves in the end but those who are rejected by the majority. These “outcasts” suffer “reproach” and “ridicule,” are “excluded” from God’s people, and, like God’s servant who gathers them, are “despised” and “abhorred” until God reverses their circumstances (Isaiah 49:7–8; 51:7; 60:15–16; 61:7, 9; 66:5–8). In the end, those who are excluded and betrayed by their own people, are gathered with God’s righteous remnant: “Thus says my Lord Jehovah, who gathers up the outcasts of Israel: ‘I will gather others to those already gathered’” (Isaiah 56:3, 8).
Thank you for all the work you have done on this post. I so long for the return of the Lord and the fulfillment of latter day prophecy.

Isaiah
captain of 100
Posts: 311

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Isaiah »

Tony wrote:"David" is a generic term for "King of the House of Israel," which was an office bestowed upon Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and John Taylor by the Council of the Fifty. The office will be reestablished when the Lord sees fit.
found this under you comment
"You cannot follow Jesus Christ unless you follow the prophet."

That is probably the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
YOU DON'T NEED THE PROPHET IF YOU HAVE CHRIST !
Yes , you can come to Christ WITHOUT the prophet !
There are people all over the world, probably better than you and me
that believe in Christ and know him, and have never even heard of the prophet.

Try listening to this guy speak about Christ.
Adrian Rogers
http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/love-worth-finding/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I wish our prophet had the same spirit of speaking of Christ.

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Silver Pie
seeker after Christ
Posts: 8989
Location: In the state that doesn't exist

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Silver Pie »

Bumping the poll.

User avatar
Silver Pie
seeker after Christ
Posts: 8989
Location: In the state that doesn't exist

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Silver Pie »

cayenne wrote: December 22nd, 2013, 4:29 pm He is hated, hidden, despised for a time, yet speaks the truth sharply and it angers people. He has the birthright, He has an amazing wife unlike most woman, He nearly dies of an illness, He has/had a Jethro figure in his life like Moses, he is from the East/North…yet for a time he sins badly, and feels no one listens to him teach the truth (I bet if he came to Avraham, he would be rejected until the time) and he suffers terribly for his brethren like a type of Christ. There is some more that I can't remember…..
I've only just begun to read this thread (even though I bumped it a day or so ago). Scriptures to back this up, please? I'm not challenging you or saying you are wrong, I just want a list of scriptures I can go to and study this for myself.

  • hated
  • hidden
  • despised for a time
  • speaks the truth sharply/angers people
  • has the birthright
  • has an amazing wife unlike most women (both parts, please, because I've met some women who are pretty awesome wives, from what I've seen; I've seen more beastly husbands than I have wives)
  • nearly dies of an illness
  • has a Jethro figure in his life
  • is from the east or north (Idaho?) :)) Sorry. Thinking of Singles' Ward - Guy is called to a mission to Boise, Idaho. After he opens the mission call and rejoices, he's like where's Idaho/Boise, and says, "I gotta get a map!" And he lives in northern Utah.
  • for a time he sins badly
  • feels no one listens to him
  • suffers terribly for his brethren, like a type of Christ

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Silver Pie
seeker after Christ
Posts: 8989
Location: In the state that doesn't exist

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Silver Pie »

Isaiah wrote: June 20th, 2016, 10:24 am This marred servant, marred because most members
will not believe his words is John.
The "marred servant" is John the Revelator
This had totally not ever occurred to me. He was thrown into a vat of hot oil, wasn't he? If so, that would fit the scripture that says he was marred more than any man. Now, I'm excited! I feel like I'm getting somewhere. :ymparty:

And thank you for the scripture references.

Also, there were several posts on page one that were really, really good and that helped with scripture references and such. Thank you (even though you folks authored them long before I thought to look up this topic).

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AI2.0
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Posts: 3917

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by AI2.0 »

cayenne wrote: December 22nd, 2013, 5:45 pm The biggest thing for me was when I wrote out all the facts of this David's life. That is when I realized how real. Hated, and mortal he is. So after doing that, this is why I see him as a future moses yet to come concurring with certain scriptures and parallels. I know there has been several David claimants over the decades, but if a claimant does not fit the facts of his life then that tells me he is false before going any further.

I wish Avraham himself would have wrote out the facts on this guy. I had to go through his books and scriptures and piece meal it together. Once you put them all together the picture of this guys life is right there.

Coach, thanks for the link, I read that paper awhile back, it is a good read and shows a viewpoint on the David thing different than mine, and I always like reading and studying all sides.

It seems with the many issues in the nations and the church that something needs to be done eventually to straighten it all out.

Avraham Gileadi does give quite a bit on the Davidic Servant, but some of yours are not ones I found.

From his book: The Last Days,

page 61-62
He is a descendant of David, who precedes Jesus' second coming. He restores Israel and Judah, their conversion and restoration. He is at first hidden from the world but to whom the Lord reveals, will gather and restore latter-day Israel. In that task, righteous Gentiles will assist him. Although we do not now know the identity of this servant, we do know, from scriptural patterns that such a servant will not announce himself but will be called of God as was David anciently through the prophet Samuel.
Isaiah prophesies that when t he Lord's servant is revealed to the orld, many will hate and ab hor him, even some of his own people. The Lord will nonetheless commission him with power to set free and gather His ancient covenant people from the ends of the earth. In conjunction with this mission, the Lord will give him power to judge Babylon. Those who will respond positively to the servants's message are those who keep the Lord's commandments, who have endured the refiner's fire. They will separate from among the wicked by leaving Babylon on the even of her destruction....

pg 125
He is a descendant of Jesse as well as Joseph

His message will be accepted by some but others will harden their hearts.


page 164:

The Lord's righteous servant exercises power over nations and rulers and releases Israel's captives.

The Lord's servant restores the tribes of Israel and unites Judah and Joseph

The Lord's servant appoints the inheritances of the Lord's people.

The Lord's servant--a new Cyrus--rebuilds Jerusalem and the temple.

The Lord's raising up of a righteous branch to David, the Lord's latter-day servant--causes Judah to be 'saved' and Israel to dwell safely.

The redemptive tasks that the servant performs are part of the restoration of all things that precedes the Lord's coming to the earth.


These ones are not familiar--and I didn't see them in this book, did you find these in another book? Also, if so, he give scriptural references in his book. Some of them sound 'iffy' to me and I would have expected them to be in his discussions on the Davidic Servant which I read.


"has an amazing wife'' (this sounds hokey..))

'nearly dies of an illness'

'has a Jethro figure in his life'

'if from the east or north'

'for a time he sins badly' (this sounds false)

'feels no one listens to him' (this sounds like a modern interpretation)

'suffers terribly for his brethren, like a type of christ'.

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AI2.0
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3917

Re: Davidic servant?

Post by AI2.0 »

Silver Pie wrote: March 25th, 2017, 12:30 pm
Isaiah wrote: June 20th, 2016, 10:24 am This marred servant, marred because most members
will not believe his words is John.
The "marred servant" is John the Revelator
This had totally not ever occurred to me. He was thrown into a vat of hot oil, wasn't he? If so, that would fit the scripture that says he was marred more than any man. Now, I'm excited! I feel like I'm getting somewhere. :ymparty:

And thank you for the scripture references.

Also, there were several posts on page one that were really, really good and that helped with scripture references and such. Thank you (even though you folks authored them long before I thought to look up this topic).
I've not heard of John being thrown in a vat of oil, is that a Catholic legend? The scripture about being 'marred more than any man' is about Christ, I'm quite certain.

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Silver Pie
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Re: Davidic servant?

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I don't know. I think I heard it in an institute class many, many years ago. No sources given.

I don't know if it's true or not. I wish I did.
As many were astonied at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men
(Old Testament | Isaiah 52:14)

----------------
As many were astonished at thee—his visage was so marred, more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men
(Book of Mormon | 3 Nephi 20:44)
I've thought, in the past, that it was about Christ, but then that didn't seem quite right. I mean, it says his visage was marred more than any man. Visage is face. His face was not marred. And the Romans nailed a lot of people to crosses. And people who have had acid thrown in their faces are more marred than Jesus was.

There is another scripture that I have been told fits the one above:
But behold, the life of my servant shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him, although he shall be marred because of them. Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil.

(Book of Mormon | 3 Nephi 21:10)
Marred, but not not hurt. Healed. Jesus wasn't healed (if it's talking about the same servant), he was killed.

In all these scriptures about the marred servant, the one mighty and strong, the davidic servant, and so forth, I have heard that they are one man. I have heard that they are many.

I've gone through all the threads I bumped (and one I pm'd to myself while on my phone and have since replied to). They have given me some scriptures to start out with (which do give me key words to punch into the scriptures on my computer, as well as footnotes to lead me to further scriptures) and they have given me some ideas.

I appreciate your reply, AI2.0. It gives me more to think about.

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Silver Pie
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Re: Davidic servant?

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What does marred mean, anyway? Maybe I'm not thinking of it in the way God meant. And could visage be a abstract, not literal? Like being excommunicated? But a lot of people have been excommunicated.

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Re: Davidic servant?

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Silver Pie wrote: March 25th, 2017, 1:55 pm I don't know. I think I heard it in an institute class many, many years ago. No sources given.

I don't know if it's true or not. I wish I did.I don't know if it's true, but it is a legend; just looked it up on google.
As many were astonied at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men
(Old Testament | Isaiah 52:14)

----------------
As many were astonished at thee—his visage was so marred, more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men
(Book of Mormon | 3 Nephi 20:44)
I've thought, in the past, that it was about Christ, but then that didn't seem quite right. I mean, it says his visage was marred more than any man. Visage is face. His face was not marred. And the Romans nailed a lot of people to crosses. And people who have had acid thrown in their faces are more marred than Jesus was.When I think of visage I think of 'form'--not just face. To look upon one's visage or form. Christ was horribly abused and scourged and a crown of thorns jammed on his head--'marred' is most definitely what he would have been and it would have been an awful sight. And all don't because of his love for us. Also, a lot of Isaiah is about Christ. He speaks messianically because Jesus Christ was who he was witnessing of.

There is another scripture that I have been told fits the one above:
But behold, the life of my servant shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him, although he shall be marred because of them. Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil.

(Book of Mormon | 3 Nephi 21:10)
Marred, but not not hurt. Healed. Jesus wasn't healed (if it's talking about the same servant), he was killed.But he overcame death--the only one to be able to do it! He WAS healed--and because of it, he carries 'healing in his wings'--in otherwords, he carries the power to 'heal' us, to snatch us from the grave and heal us through resurrection. So, yes, he WAS healed and because of it, he healed us. I don't have any doubt these are about Christ and the atonement--What's it's all about and what all Prophets looked forward to, this great act of atonement which would save us.

In all these scriptures about the marred servant, the one mighty and strong, the davidic servant, and so forth, I have heard that they are one man. I have heard that they are many.I've never read these to be the same person-- he who was 'marred' is Christ, who overcame all through his act of atonement and is prophesied by Isaiah in particular. The 'one mighty and strong' is in the D&C and is a specific revelation to Edward Partridge during the early days of the united order in Jackson county and the giving of inheritances (but it's been misconstrued because many fundamentalists have come forward over the years to claim to be this person and thought 'setting the house in order' meant fixing the church, not the situation in Jackson County and the law of Consecration) and the Davidic Servant is the Messiah Ben David who is a messiah to the Jews and will carry out his mission to prepare them for the second coming and help to reunite the house of Israel. While some scriptures can be talking about more than one event or person, I think it is important to not be led astray by dubious interpretations, especially those who are trying to massage the prophecies to fit certain persons or events, it seems to be a new thing to try to put these all together into one person.

I've gone through all the threads I bumped (and one I pm'd to myself while on my phone and have since replied to). They have given me some scriptures to start out with (which do give me key words to punch into the scriptures on my computer, as well as footnotes to lead me to further scriptures) and they have given me some ideas.

I appreciate your reply, AI2.0. It gives me more to think about.It's given me more to think about too. I have not read about the Messiah Ben David in a long time--pulled out my Avraham Gileadi books to relook at as I try to remember what the prophecies are. I also like to look at things from an earlier time, when people weren't influenced by present day events.

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Silver Pie
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Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Silver Pie »

Thanks for your extensive reply. You have given me more to think about and ponder on.

I looked up "visage" in Strong's dictionary yesterday, and I was wrong. "Face" is not in any of the meanings.

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Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Alaris »

cayenne wrote: December 22nd, 2013, 4:29 pm This is an interesting topic

So is this David servant real? or not?

What are the facts of his life if he is real?

I personally think he is real, I think Avraham Gileadi nailed it…..and from Avraham's books and scripture ……I learned all this….

He is hated, hidden, despised for a time, yet speaks the truth sharply and it angers people. He has the birthright, He has an amazing wife unlike most woman, He nearly dies of an illness, He has/had a Jethro figure in his life like Moses, he is from the East/North…yet for a time he sins badly, and feels no one listens to him teach the truth (I bet if he came to Avraham, he would be rejected until the time) and he suffers terribly for his brethren like a type of Christ. There is some more that I can't remember…..

By the way, I guess David Cohen claims to be David, yet we learn from scripture David is part Ephraim and part Judah….oops…i think Cohen is Levi and Ephraim…..little stuff like this is so easy to spot, and disqualifies Cohen.

So anyone claiming to be him better fit all his qualifications….and me thinks he is very disliked, which means whether he is in Israel, or America, or Siberia, or Mormon, Catholic, etc…..he is hated (know anyone like this?) or maybe he is yet to be born? etc
Cayenne,

Please tell me where Avraham Gileadi learned this about the DS' wife. A lot of what you posted here aligns with what I've studied and pondered.

This is an amazing post--thank you.

Here's what I believe based of my study and prayers:

1. The DS is someone from the past reborn (MMP) - James the son of Zebedee is where my money is (Look at John the Baptist being Elias / Christ was Melchizedek, etc.)
2. The DS ascends during his life .. this is his ascension to archangel status. I subsequently learned that Gileadi supposedly teaches the same concept or a similar one
3. The DS is mentioned at the end of Ezekiel 37, but I believe that he will be involved with all of Ezekiel 37 which is the chapter where Ezekiel is shown a host being resurrected.
4. Point 3 may be related to this, but the DS will bring forth or call forth the hosts of heaven...possibly the armies of heaven
5. I believe the DS is the angel Jahoel from the Apocalypse of Abraham. The very last verses mention an "Elect One" after speaking of the antichrist. Jahoel accompanies Abraham and teaches him and after he leaves the Lord reveals the antichrist and the DS. I believe he reveals this to Abraham to not only see where his seed are headed but to show him that the angel with whom he was communing will be the elect one who brings it all home. http://www.pseudepigrapha.com/pseudepig ... raham.html
6. Jahoel / DS was the head of the order of seraphim - one level below the archangels.
7. Jahoel did something to win favor / popularity with the hosts of heaven.

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Alaris
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Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Alaris »

Isaiah wrote: June 20th, 2016, 10:24 am 3 Nephi 21:10 But behold, the life of my servant shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him, although he shall be marred because of them. Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil.

This is not Joseph Smith, because this "servant", "shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him", Joseph Smith was killed.

This marred servant, marred because most members
will not believe his words is John.
The "marred servant" is John the Revelator

He will be a descendent of Jesse, or of the
royal Davidic lineage.
he will be a righteous ruler because he will
judge the people, hence he is a Davidic king.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
D&C113
5 What is the root of Jesse spoken of in the 10th verse of the 11th chapter?

6 Behold, thus saith the Lord, it is a descendant of Jesse,
as well as of Joseph, unto whom rightly belongs the priesthood,
and the keys of the kingdom, for an ensign,
and for the gathering of my people in the last days.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 Nephi 21:10
10 "But behold, the life of my servant
shall be in my hand; therefore they shall not hurt him,
although he shall be marred because of them.
Yet I will heal him, for I will show unto them
that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil."

--------------------------------------------------------------------
Thank you for this awesome post. I have to say the Davidic Servant is not John the Revelator. John is translated and is unable to be marred. Please see the Book of Mormon for reference on how the three nephites were burned and buried and nothing could harm or stop them. Also, John was banished to Patmos because nobody could kill him.

Also, I think D&C 113 6 would have just called him out as John if that were the case because why not? He's already here and immortal.

I do believe the DS is James, John's older brother. Peter, James, and John. That is the order. Peter is one of the seven archangels. Moses was over the 3rd order of beings who had just entered the gate (which is why they were so terrible at following the commandments and were only given the lesser law.) Peter is over 2nd order beings - these are the beings that are lower than God's chosen (3 and on up) where Peter was given the charge to carry the gospel to them to those who are ready to ascend to level 3. This is why the gospel was never preached to the world before Peter.

Joseph Smith is over level 1 - the baseline and most numerous - which is why the work of the temples were begun through him. Joseph is over the baseline order to ensure every soul who wants to ascend will get such an opportunity.

James is the first counselor to Peter. I believe he is Jahoel and the chief of the seraphim--level 6 beings. Once Joseph Smith finished his work, then the 7 archangels each finished their mortal work and now it's on to the next in the hierarchy--the chief of level 6 beings or seraphim. James will ascend as the DS to the order of level 7. The Davidic Servant and the 6th order beings will ascend the earth from its 6th thousand years to the 7th - the ascension of the DS being a rich parallel from 6 to 7.

Isaiah 6 is a super interesting chapter about an ordinance of level 6 beings - the seraphim. They have 6 wings - two with which to hide their face - two their feet, and two to fly. Gileadi's translation mentions that they are hiding their identity (face) and their location (feet.) This fits with the DS being hidden .. until he's not. As he ascends he goes from being of a secret order to one of great publicity.

Whether the DS is ever identified as James will be interesting to see, because I believe MMP is one of those truths he may reveal along with the sealed 2/3 portion (what is sealed away that lesser beings can't digest?) - and this would be yet another layer of poetry and parallel where the DS reveals he's James and perhaps others.

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Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Alaris »

Interesting that President Uchtdorf used the sons of Zebedee in his Priesthood talk to illustrate how godly favor is obtained and made a special point to caution against inhaling praise. To whom was this talk directed I wonder.

President Eyring's talk also seemed almost like an extension of Uchtdorf's. It seemed like he was talking to someone specific in several parts of his talk.

Also of note that the first two counselors were speaking of the sons of Zebedee who also were the first and second counselors and seemed like their talks were in concert.

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Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Kingdom of ZION »

jwharton wrote: August 10th, 2015, 9:07 pm
Lizzy60 wrote:No, rewcox, he won't be the President of the Church.

He will be as much a part of the established Church as John the Baptist was.
Lizzy60,

You are confusing the Elias/Elijah/John servant with the Davidic servant.

The Elias/Elijah/John servant will be excommunicated but this won't do anything to take away his authority anymore than the Pharisees casting John the Baptist out into the wilderness did.

The seat where the prophet like unto Moses shall sit is indeed the office of the president of the church.
This is the Davidic servant's seat and in due time, once the Luciferian counterfeit runs its course and is cast down, Christ shall sit in that seat.

See 2 Thessalonians chapter 2. It is quite clear that when Christ returns there is a standing partial apostasy that God has temporarily allowed to gain power that will be done away with and then Christ will take His rightful place as both presiding high priest as well as king of the kingdom.

We are still in the stage of having fallen back from Celestial Law to lesser laws, which is the falling away Paul was referring to that would be standing.

I do not look at what one sect or people are doing or focusing upon. It would be like worrying if the Amish are having a great following away :)

I do not look to one sect or people as to having the correct interpretation of all the Prophecies. It would be like trying to see what the future will bring when you have bad eye sight and have forgotten to put on your glasses ;)

I do not look forth to the end times, to have popular books or peoples unpublished ideas revealing the mysteries and declaring the true understandings of the purposes of G_d, that the prophecies hint at (-|

I do not follow an individual or persons, as if someone has already shown forth that they are called and chosen to do a might work in the earth. :(

Personal Revelation is the cornerstone I lay upon the Chief Cornerstone, as my path is my own, and others have their own paths. What I need will be revealed unto me according to my diligence in seeking such knowledge and insights, as it applies to me. If I share what I have received and it blesses others, it brings joy to my souls, but it is not the purpose as to why I have received such. Honors of men and pride I abhor, I do not want anyone to follow me! Rather, I long for Brethren to stand shoulder to shoulder and work along side of me to sustain one and other and to one day help build the kingdom.

With that said I will say what I know and I believe Joseph Smith knew/taught:

Elijah was John the Baptist, because the Messiah said so!
Elijah will come in the End Times as the Davidic Servant.
Elijah/John/DS is one of the eight Archangel's of this Creation, named Sariel.
Elijah is the next Dispensation King, of the 'Dispensation of the Gathering of Yesrael from the four corners of the Earth'.
Elijah will restore that which he was the last one to hold upon the earth, a Priesthood which contains the power of
Translation, the Patriarchal Priesthood, and embodies the Sealing Keys, thereby turning the hearts of the Children to
the Eternal Fathers and these Fathers to their Children.
Elijah and his Brother shall be the Two Witnesses that plague Apostate Israel until the very end, shall be killed by fire
(marred), lay dead in the streets of Jerusalem for three and one half days.

If you disagree, that is fine, time proves all things in the end,
Shalom

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Alaris
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Re: Davidic servant?

Post by Alaris »

Kingdom of ZION wrote: April 4th, 2017, 9:40 am
jwharton wrote: August 10th, 2015, 9:07 pm
Lizzy60 wrote:No, rewcox, he won't be the President of the Church.

He will be as much a part of the established Church as John the Baptist was.
Lizzy60,

You are confusing the Elias/Elijah/John servant with the Davidic servant.

The Elias/Elijah/John servant will be excommunicated but this won't do anything to take away his authority anymore than the Pharisees casting John the Baptist out into the wilderness did.

The seat where the prophet like unto Moses shall sit is indeed the office of the president of the church.
This is the Davidic servant's seat and in due time, once the Luciferian counterfeit runs its course and is cast down, Christ shall sit in that seat.

See 2 Thessalonians chapter 2. It is quite clear that when Christ returns there is a standing partial apostasy that God has temporarily allowed to gain power that will be done away with and then Christ will take His rightful place as both presiding high priest as well as king of the kingdom.

We are still in the stage of having fallen back from Celestial Law to lesser laws, which is the falling away Paul was referring to that would be standing.

I do not look at what one sect or people are doing or focusing upon. It would be like worrying if the Amish are having a great following away :)

I do not look to one sect or people as to having the correct interpretation of all the Prophecies. It would be like trying to see what the future will bring when you have bad eye sight and have forgotten to put on your glasses ;)

I do not look forth to the end times, to have popular books or peoples unpublished ideas revealing the mysteries and declaring the true understandings of the purposes of G_d, that the prophecies hint at (-|

I do not follow an individual or persons, as if someone has already shown forth that they are called and chosen to do a might work in the earth. :(

Personal Revelation is the cornerstone I lay upon the Chief Cornerstone, as my path is my own, and others have their own paths. What I need will be revealed unto me according to my diligence in seeking such knowledge and insights, as it applies to me. If I share what I have received and it blesses others, it brings joy to my souls, but it is not the purpose as to why I have received such. Honors of men and pride I abhor, I do not want anyone to follow me! Rather, I long for Brethren to stand shoulder to shoulder and work along side of me to sustain one and other and to one day help build the kingdom.

With that said I will say what I know and I believe Joseph Smith knew/taught:

Elijah was John the Baptist, because the Messiah said so!
Elijah will come in the End Times as the Davidic Servant.
Elijah/John/DS is one of the eight Archangel's of this Creation, named Sariel.
Elijah is the next Dispensation King, of the 'Dispensation of the Gathering of Yesrael from the four corners of the Earth'.
Elijah will restore that which he was the last one to hold upon the earth, a Priesthood which contains the power of
Translation, the Patriarchal Priesthood, and embodies the Sealing Keys, thereby turning the hearts of the Children to
the Eternal Fathers and these Fathers to their Children.
Elijah and his Brother shall be the Two Witnesses that plague Apostate Israel until the very end, shall be killed by fire
(marred), lay dead in the streets of Jerusalem for three and one half days.

If you disagree, that is fine, time proves all things in the end,
Shalom
KOZ, why do you say Elijah and his brother?

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