Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Rep?

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TonyOlsen
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by TonyOlsen »

Fiannan wrote:
kathyn wrote:LV architect is the voice of reason here. Listen to him, please. Protesting at the event could cause so much harm to the church. There must be other avenues where one can voice his concern. You can justify doing protesting at this event, but it will still be wrong. This fireside isn't a political speech, this is about faith. So let it be, for heaven's sake. Do you really think this fireside will change anyone's vote? I don't. Far worse damage will occur from protesting than can occur from a talk.
You know, I think it is sad that the best speaker that can be found in Nevada to speak at a fireside is Harry Reid. Was Chad Hardy busy? :shock:

But seriously, if so many members of the church would love to send Mr. Reid to a permanent mission assignment in Tibet, are we just assuming that investigators and recent converts are all left-wing Democrats? Isn't there a greater chance that these people will harbor negative feelings towards this clown and get a bad taste in their mouth in regards to the church?
How about Cuba? I learned about the ills of Socialism from serving a mission in East Germany... perhaps Harry Reid could use some similar cleansing?

Since all Socialists are either ignorant or corrupt, I'm hoping, for the sake of Harry's immortal soul, that he is merely ignorant... and therefor has some hope.

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by Wiikwajio »

TonyOlsen wrote: How about Cuba? I learned about the ills of Socialism from serving a mission in East Germany... perhaps Harry Reid could use some similar cleansing?

Since all Socialists are either ignorant or corrupt, I'm hoping, for the sake of Harry's immortal soul, that he is merely ignorant... and therefor has some hope.
So what exactly is a Socialist?

Is it a person with a Social Security Number?

Is it a person that pays a progressive income tax?

Is it a person that believes Federal Reserve Notes are dollars?

Is it a person that drops their child off at a free public school?

Maybe it would be easier to explain what a Socialist is not.

Did they practice Socialism or Communism in East Germany?

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TonyOlsen
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Mazal wrote:Did you know Harry was the Mormon of the year for 2009?

http://timesandseasons.org/index.php/20 ... arry-reid/
I followed the inner link:

http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng ... s-s-monson
President Monson said: “President Obama’s heritage is rich with examples of leadership, sacrifice and service. We were very pleased to research his family history and are honored to present it to him today.”
President Monson has more love for the fellow man than I. I'm impressed.

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TonyOlsen
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Wiikwajio wrote:
TonyOlsen wrote: How about Cuba? I learned about the ills of Socialism from serving a mission in East Germany... perhaps Harry Reid could use some similar cleansing?

Since all Socialists are either ignorant or corrupt, I'm hoping, for the sake of Harry's immortal soul, that he is merely ignorant... and therefor has some hope.
So what exactly is a Socialist?

Is it a person with a Social Security Number?

Is it a person that pays a progressive income tax?

Is it a person that believes Federal Reserve Notes are dollars?

Is it a person that drops their child off at a free public school?

Maybe it would be easier to explain what a Socialist is not.
Those are all examples of Socialism, yes.
Wiikwajio wrote:Did they practice Socialism or Communism in East Germany?
Both.

East Germany was part of Communist Russia controlled U.S.S.R., which stands for the "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics". This is the point where the ignorant Liberals shout "But Hitler's Socialism was enemies with Stalin's Communism"... yes, they were: like 2 gangs fighting for control of Chicago. But even though the 2 gangs are enemies... they believe in the same ideology. Having 2 Socialism/Communist countries fight each other shouldn't surprise anyone, since Socialism/Communism is a house divided against itself.

...anyone who has read Karl Marx's Communist Manifesto knows that Socialism and Communism are intertwined with each other.

Stalin's Communist Russia and Hitler's Socialist Germany share so many common elements. You can look at their propeganda posters. The millions they both killed. Both were Marxist. Both opposed freedom and sought for world domination.

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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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TonyOlsen wrote:President Monson has more love for the fellow man than I. I'm impressed.
He is wonderful and charitable man. I hope to develop more of his traits.

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AussieOi
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Only an idiot and a fool follows an instruction they know to be wrong

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InfoWarrior82
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Two things:

First, I wonder if Harry Reid ever gets up and bears his testimony on Fast Sunday. If he does, I would love to hear it. Haha.

Second, I wonder if his bishop has ever/will ever call him to give a talk in his home ward.

If the answer to these is "NO", then you can therefore assign this whole stake fireside thing to be purely POLITICAL.

Are stake presidents in the business of picking out random members in ward congregations to give talks? Of course, this is not at all random. I doubt Glenn Beck ever gets called for Stake Firesides... why? Too controversial. Why in this case was it ok?

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Joppa
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Raindrop wrote:
LV Architect wrote: We can all argue the wisdom of asking Harry Reid to speak, but please, let us avoid compromising things eternal for things proximate and temporal.
Once things "proximate and temporal" run their course, with Reid, Pelosi et.al. at the wheel, we won't need to be concerned much with things eternal. You see much in the way of church work, temple work or missionary work under marxism? The way the human family is governed in this life means EVERYTHING, my friend.
actually this is incorrect, didn't Joseph Smith in a letter say that no unhallowed hand can stop this work?
"the Standard of Truth has been erected; no unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing; persecutions may rage, mobs may combine, armies may assemble, calumny may defame, but the truth of God will go forth boldly, nobly, and independent, till it has penetrated every continent, visited every clime, swept every country, and sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished, and the Great Jehovah shall say the work is done.” Joseph Smith (History of the Church 4:540)
Aint nothing going to stop the work of the Lord going forth!

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by Wiikwajio »

TonyOlsen wrote: Both.

East Germany was part of Communist Russia controlled U.S.S.R., which stands for the "Union of Soviet Socialist Republics". This is the point where the ignorant Liberals shout "But Hitler's Socialism was enemies with Stalin's Communism"... yes, they were: like 2 gangs fighting for control of Chicago. But even though the 2 gangs are enemies... they believe in the same ideology. Having 2 Socialism/Communist countries fight each other shouldn't surprise anyone, since Socialism/Communism is a house divided against itself.

...anyone who has read Karl Marx's Communist Manifesto knows that Socialism and Communism are intertwined with each other.

Stalin's Communist Russia and Hitler's Socialist Germany share so many common elements. You can look at their propeganda posters. The millions they both killed. Both were Marxist. Both opposed freedom and sought for world domination.
Thanks

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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TonyOlsen wrote: President Monson has more love for the fellow man than I. I'm impressed.
I believe the prophet worked with King David also.

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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InfoWarrior82 wrote: Why in this case was it ok?
Because it was not okay but no body cared except outcasts that still love the gospel.

If you are not a Marxist in this church today you will not be called to positions of authority. IMHO :(

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by Wiikwajio »

Joppa wrote:
Raindrop wrote:
LV Architect wrote: We can all argue the wisdom of asking Harry Reid to speak, but please, let us avoid compromising things eternal for things proximate and temporal.
Once things "proximate and temporal" run their course, with Reid, Pelosi et.al. at the wheel, we won't need to be concerned much with things eternal. You see much in the way of church work, temple work or missionary work under marxism? The way the human family is governed in this life means EVERYTHING, my friend.
actually this is incorrect, didn't Joseph Smith in a letter say that no unhallowed hand can stop this work?
"the Standard of Truth has been erected; no unhallowed hand can stop the work from progressing; persecutions may rage, mobs may combine, armies may assemble, calumny may defame, but the truth of God will go forth boldly, nobly, and independent, till it has penetrated every continent, visited every clime, swept every country, and sounded in every ear, till the purposes of God shall be accomplished, and the Great Jehovah shall say the work is done.” Joseph Smith (History of the Church 4:540)
Aint nothing going to stop the work of the Lord going forth!
Progression is to move forward. The speed it moves forward can be slowed to nearly a halt and yet it can still be called progression.

When you burn a forest to the ground is that progression? I guess that depends upon you view point. Are you a mighty redwood or a struggling bush. The fire will kill the redwood and the bush can now thrive.

If you have 100 evil people in a town and a plague comes and kills 150 people and now 50 good righteous people remain is that progression? If there are 250,000,000 evil people in AMerica and a plague comes and kills 300,000,000 including all the evil people is that progression?

lundbaek
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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From a prominent activist in this area:

"Last Friday my sister-in-law sent me a disturbing email that a Stake President in Nevada had invited Harry Reid to be the main speaker at a church fireside. I called Mark Tuttle at the church office building in SLC and explained my dismay and shock that Harry Reid would be invited to speak in such a setting. Brother Tuttle told me that they leave such decisions up to the individual Stake Presidents. My dad emailed me later that day to let me know that Mark Tuttle received MANY calls from concerned church members throughout the day and the church directed the Stake President to NOT have Harry Reid speak at the fireside. I thought that was great news! We CAN still make a difference... thank goodness!"

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by Wiikwajio »

And another one:

cult hero Says:
March 29th, 2010 at 7:40 pm
Only someone ridiculously naive would ask “what about this was political?” During election season—especially if you’re a guy who is in real trouble in your bid for reelection—anything that puts you in contact with potential voters is political. It just is. You don’t get to be senate majority leader while being ignorant of that particular portion of reality.

Here’s how this goes down: He tells some annoyingly heart-warming story about and half the mindless sheep in the room think, “Man, he really is a good guy. I should vote for him.” How often does Reid give firesides when it ISN’T election season?

I get so tired of hearing how you wussy Mormons aren’t get to “judge someone’s spirituality.” A man is defined by his actions. Reid’s politically corrupt. You can’t be politically corrupt and work day in and day out to sell out your countrymen and be just fine spiritually. You people need to stop believing you can somehow put up a magic barrier wherein no one is morally responsible for their actions in the political arena. Every moron out there who voted for George W Bush is in their own way responsible for his wickedness.

I’m disgusted by anyone who would allow a shrewd politician to enter their house of worship under the guise of being “purely religious” while whoring himself out for votes. Does the phrase “avoid the appearance of impropriety” mean anything to you people? I’m also disgusted by whatever genius thought this was a good idea. You want to have Harry Reid at a fireside when it’s 3 years into his term, fine. Whatever. You want that filth in your house, you’re welcome to it. However, during election season it’s totally unethical.

I mean, imagine how inappropriate it would look if, hypothetically, the prophet died and a Mormon was a presidential candidate at the time and showed up and got front row treatment? Let’s also say, hypothetically, that this same guy was the governor of an extremely liberal state and regularly endorsed policies that were antithetical to church teachings. (Oh wait. This suddenly isn’t sounding too hypothetical.)

You cannot separate your political choices from the rest of your life. The ballot might be secret, but God knows who you vote for and you better expect that He might ask you why you did what you did. Even an ignorant vote is morally wrong, because it’s irresponsible execution of your personal sovereignty.

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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Progression is to move forward. The speed it moves forward can be slowed to nearly a halt and yet it can still be called progression.

When you burn a forest to the ground is that progression? I guess that depends upon you view point. Are you a mighty redwood or a struggling bush. The fire will kill the redwood and the bush can now thrive.

If you have 100 evil people in a town and a plague comes and kills 150 people and now 50 good righteous people remain is that progression? If there are 250,000,000 evil people in AMerica and a plague comes and kills 300,000,000 including all the evil people is that progression?
that says NOTHING will stop the work from progressing, you really think that Satan is more powerful than God and can stop His work? Or even slow it down? well I'm glad that my God is more powerful than satan

lundbaek
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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From a prominent activist in this area:

"If Reid was a righteous man- I would love to hear him speak at a fireside. I honor and respect men by their righteous living not by their titles such as President, Senator, Govorner, etc. Hitler was once considered a great ruler but I would not have wanted to listen to him at a fireside. Firesides are meant to be inspirational and bring people closer to Christ. Reid has publicly spoken against the church. He has shown his true colors and has chosen to push a path on the American people that will promote slavery through taxation. He believes in taking away our freedoms and forcing the liberal or progressive agenda down our throats."

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AussieOi
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Wiikwajio wrote:If you are not a Marxist in this church today you will not be called to positions of authority. IMHO :(

and yet here i am issuing temple recommends.

i love your stuff but bro, i think the chip is against the church. we need your energy_protecting_the church

i agree, too many bishops and SPs are idiots.

but EVERYONE by your definition is socialist. so of course they're always gonna call a marxist

u gotta stop the chip against the modern authority. yeah they are water weak, but they dont lead us astray. for the bulk of members all they can stomach is water and crackers, so it goes to say we'd have water cracker guys up with them

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by Wiikwajio »

AussieOi wrote:
Wiikwajio wrote:If you are not a Marxist in this church today you will not be called to positions of authority. IMHO :(

and yet here i am issuing temple recommends.

i love your stuff but bro, i think the chip is against the church. we need your energy_protecting_the church

i agree, too many bishops and SPs are idiots.

but EVERYONE by your definition is socialist. so of course they're always gonna call a marxist

u gotta stop the chip against the modern authority. yeah they are water weak, but they dont lead us astray. for the bulk of members all they can stomach is water and crackers, so it goes to say we'd have water cracker guys up with them
I never claimed they led us astray. I am looking for answers. I do not hate the Church leadership at all. I find them amazing. After reading what Presidents Grant, McKay and Clark wrote my blame is 100% on the members. The leadership is FORCED to deal with members that revel in socialism. How can they deal with it? I think they are doing all they can and doing everything right.

I am not accusing them of any wrong doing at all. They give milk to milk drinkers. That is what God would have them do. The problem is with the milker drinkers, not those that give them the milk. Members WANT to be commanded in all things. THey want to be led. They do not want to stand up and do good or risk jail or death like Joseph SMith or Brigham or John Taylor. They accuse people that have difficulties with the law of being unrighteous. They accuse people that fight against Marxism as being trouble makers that are not following the God. They chase people that are willing to risk it all for liberty out of the churches. Most of the freedom fighters I know, and I know plenty, are all Jack Mormons.

Why?

Because they caused the milk drinkers to be uncomfortable in their comfortable worship of Marxism.

Presidents Grant, McKay and Clark said they had no practical solutions. Why? Because it was and is not their job. Those that embrace Marxism stay in the Garden. Those that eat the fruit risk death and hardships.

I have seen true Christians that were willing to go to the lions rather than lie to reduce a sentence because they would have to admit they were wrong. I have NEVER seen that kind of devotion to the Lord from a single "Good Mormon."

And these milk drinkers are what the prophet and the Apostles have to work with. It is like trying to build a fortress out of sand.

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Joppa wrote: that says NOTHING will stop the work from progressing, you really think that Satan is more powerful than God and can stop His work? Or even slow it down? well I'm glad that my God is more powerful than satan
President Benson said that Satan could indeed slow down the work of God. Are you claiming he was wrong? Read Not Commanded in All Things. God has to work with members. So does Satan. What they do affects the Lord's work. If not then God can force us and that is Satanic.

Because we have not done what was commanded the blood will be deeper and the chains heavier.

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AussieOi
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Wiikwajio wrote:. I am looking for answers..

hmm, don't think you're gonna find them in a hurry brother



to all. can i pose the question. IF harry were a Republican and this were in Utah, who thinks this would have gone ahead?

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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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IF harry were a Republican and this were in Utah, who thinks this would have gone ahead?
A Republican who promoted the 'Hell Bill' as Senate Majority Leader? NO!

As a common bribe taker from the Senate? Probably

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TonyOlsen
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Wiikwajio wrote:
InfoWarrior82 wrote: Why in this case was it ok?
Because it was not okay but no body cared except outcasts that still love the gospel.

If you are not a Marxist in this church today you will not be called to positions of authority. IMHO :(
Yes, there are many in the Church today that are ignorant to the principles of Liberty versus Tyranny. (Many actually ignorantly believe that Socialism is the same of the "Law of Consecration" - They obviously don't understand the details, nor have they read Marion G. Romney's and Ezra Taft Benson's talks on the subject. Socialism is Satan's counterfeit of the "Law of Consecration". While they have some aspects in common, the key aspects are mirror opposites: The Law of Consecration is based on Freedom of Choice (voluntary) and Property rights, whereas Socialism is based on Control (force) and Tyranny and no Property rights... among many other things).

But I do not believe the above statement is true. I believe that being a Socialist Liberal is in conflict with God's eternal principals just like all other forms of Sin are. You may find someone in positions in the Church that is not yet cleansed from all sin, but the higher you go, the more cleansed they are. Our local Branch President ("Branch" being perhaps the wrong term, since our "Branch" consists of 100+ active members) is a true Title-Of-Liberty conservative. :D

lundbaek
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by lundbaek »

Is there any indication or evidence that an order to scrub the fireside came from Church HQ? I certainly hope so, and I hope for the right reason, which, IMO, is because of Reid's public criticism of Church support of CA Prop 8, and public criticism of President Benson. There may have been a genuine concern about security. I just cannot understand how supposedly righteous, intelligent LDSs could bring themselves to invite Senator Reid to speak at a church fireside. His testimony must be weak in certain areas.

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Wiikwajio

Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

Post by Wiikwajio »

AussieOi wrote:
Wiikwajio wrote:. I am looking for answers..
hmm, don't think you're gonna find them in a hurry brother
I have been looking for well over a 3 decades. But I think I finally found a way to get those answers and it should be great fun finding them now.

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Joppa
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Re: Harry Reid Firesides ordered by Nevada's LDS Regional Re

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Wiikwajio wrote:
Joppa wrote: that says NOTHING will stop the work from progressing, you really think that Satan is more powerful than God and can stop His work? Or even slow it down? well I'm glad that my God is more powerful than satan
President Benson said that Satan could indeed slow down the work of God. Are you claiming he was wrong? Read Not Commanded in All Things. God has to work with members. So does Satan. What they do affects the Lord's work. If not then God can force us and that is Satanic.

Because we have not done what was commanded the blood will be deeper and the chains heavier.
can you give me quote? I read it and must have missed the part where satan can slow the work of God

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